Going WAY advanced with the modding... finally

Discussion in 'Furious 320 Advanced / Modding Forum' started by J Rogers, Jan 27, 2017.

  1. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    Howdy All!

    It's taken longer than expected, but I'm finally getting ready to re-visit my Furious 320 project.

    After getting lost in the 250 racer world for a few months, I ran across a flight controller which I felt would work great as a replacement to the one in the F320. For those that don't know, I've already made the mods to replace the F320g FC with the F320c FC, and while I did feel more confident in the flight stability improvements perceived, overall the Furious 320 system felt very unstable... Then I discovered the BrainFPV re1!

    So I've been testing the hell out of the BrainFPV re1 for the last couple of months in a 260 racer and feel quite confident in it's flight stability and wide range of hardware support(ie. barometer, compass, GPS, DSHOT). Okay, DShot is currently only supported in Betaflight, DRonin has mentioned given way and supporting it in future releases... For the ESC's I'm going with these Racestar 35A one's because... well, they were just sitting around with nothing better to do.

    Now the real question here is, I could use some feedback on the motor's that I've chosen... Well, perhaps not so much chosen as I have them in another build that I plan to upgrade. They're a set of Emax RS2205S 2300kv, and the question is, does anybody think that the Furious 320 would be too heavy for these motors? It's not so much the thrust I'm worried of as is the torque required due to the extra weight. I'm flying these motors on a quad weighing in at 660 without issues, but I think that the F320 is almost twice that weight.

    My apologies for this intended short inquiry becoming so long-winded, but a bit of background seemed appropriate and any insight to this motor inquiry would be very much so appreciated.

     
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  2. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    ***PROJECT UP DATE***
    Finished with the rough draft!!! It's not very pretty but I do believe that it's flight ready :) As you can see in the attached photos I'm using a different folding mast for the receiver antennas, I've gone with a different RHCP antenna for the VTX, and I've dropped the stock props for a set of Dal props, 6x45 tri-blades to be exact ;)

    I do have concerns in regards to the VERY short threads on prop shafts. The third image shows how few threads are available for the prop nut. I'm hoping that with a bit of thread lock applied that these will do, otherwise I'll have to swap the motors out. In regards to the motors I decided to stick with the stock motors... mainly out of laziness... but they do seem to be very solid motors, so I figured I'd give them a second chance. If I do swap them out, then it'll be for the Emax RS2205S 2300kv motors.

    While it did take me a little while, I did finally get the tilt servo to play nice with betaflight, but it did require a bit of resource remapping in the CLI to make it happen. I have Betaflight 3.1rc1 loaded. Due to the limitations of the BrainFPV re1 flight controller, both the gyro & PID loop times are locked in at 3.2khz, which then also means that even though I do have DShot600 running, it's loop time is locked with the PID... oh well. I do also have installed the barometer attachment for the BrainFPV re1, which results in a fairly accurate altimeter in the OSD. With an external GPS/Compass installed in place of the original, the OSD should also now show an accurate air/ground speed. The original receiver has been replaced with a FrSky L9R, connected through SBUS & RSSI output to OSD.

    Unfortunately it's been raining and due to remain so for the next few days. During the rainy down time I suppose that I could work on getting the extra plastic trim pieces on, but frankly I don't think that they'll help it fly better ;) and a more stable flight experience is what this project has been about after all :)
     

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    Last edited: Feb 6, 2017
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  3. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    ***PROJECT UP DATE---MAIDEN FLIGHT!!!***
    Finally had some great weather to take this project on it's maiden flight! I am very happy to report that the flight went, by far, better than I had anticipated. In fact, if you're reading this, you own it to yourself to heavily consider following in my footsteps. I've finally made the Walkera Furious 320 worthy of flight! I was hoping for more, but in these 2 flights I got the craft up to 95mph(152.89kmh) @ 75amps.

    First flight:
    FPV View:

    Crappy camera dude view:
    In this flight I had the maximum angle value set to 25deg, in which I found that I would loose altitude unless at 100% throttle.
    Second flight:
    FPV view:

    In this flight I modified the max angle down to 20deg, which helped, but then I really started to notice an issue...

    Adjusting the maximum angle limits both the pitch and the roll, so I'm wondering if there's anybody reading this that might have insight into the best practice to limit the pitch and roll angles independently. Betaflight's default angle limit in angle mode is 55deg, which is fine for roll, but I think that limiting the pitch to something like 22-23deg would be ideal.
     
  4. oldking80
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    oldking80 Member

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    Fantastic! Can you post the propellers links?
    And parameters changed in Fly Config for pitch and roll? Thanks!
     
  5. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    For the tri-blade props I went with the DAL "Indestructible" 6045 props.

    As for the parameter changes, please do keep in mind that Fly Config is no longer used in this project; 90% of the avionics, including the flight controller, have been replaced. In this case I'm flying a BrainFPV re1 using their own blend of BetaFlight 3.1, so all parameter changes are done through the Betaflight Configurator.

    The solution to my angle issue ended up being a combination of adjustments in both betaflight and the transmitter that I'm using. The main issue that needed addressing was hitting full tilt in the rotors prior to full pitch tilt. Rather than messing around with the angle limiter in Betaflight, I set an extra channel on my transmitter to be controller by the elevator stick. I boosted the input from 100 to 125 on the new channel and reduced the actual elevator from 100 to 50. In Betaflight I set the angle limit to 45deg; the issue that I had been running into was that this variable controlled both the pitch & roll, so by making the adjustments in the transmitter and having the servo take commands from the new channel, I'm able to maintain a full 45deg adjustment in my ailerons while having the elevator reduced to 22.5deg. Between the actual pitch and the rotor tilt, with the stock motors and tri-blade props, 67.5deg total tilt seems to be something of a sweet spot :)

    Now I'm on the hunt for the best possible replacement motors, which I'm starting to think may be harder than one would think. At full throttle I'm hitting 75amps total consumption; in comparison, my mini-quads can hit between 125-140apms no problem. The main reason I'm looking to upgrade the motors is that they really don't punch out the way that I'd like. I'm open to any and all suggestions at this point, but even with the stock motors this heavily modified Furious 320g is finally a dream to fly and hella easy to control. Why Walkera couldn't have done this in the first place is beyond me.

    If the Furious 320g could have come with the modification's I've made to the craft, it would totally be worth the original $700 investment ;)

    Best regards,

    JRogers
     
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  6. bjr981s
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    bjr981s Moderator Staff Member

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    Have you had a look at the Eachine Tilt Rotor?

    It goes like a scalded cat and stays dead flat at high speed.

    I have one and as far as I can tell the rotor tilt is directly linked to the elevator control from the RX.
     
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  7. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    That Eachine Tilt-Rotor looks cool, and the flight video I checked out does suggest that it stays rather level during flight. Would be nice though if it was just a little larger; just large enough to fit a set of RaceKraft RK5051 props ;) With it's 2350kv motors and an AUW 500+ grams less than the Furious 320, I have no doubt that it can haul ass.

    At this point I'm just glad that I was able to make the best out of two bad investments(Furious 320 & BrainFPVre1 FC) by combining the two. And actually, the BrainFPV re1 FC really isn't bad, but it was misleading in the sense that it's advertised as a F4 FC that runs BetaFlight; I think that most folk that are purchasing a F4 FC are doing do to run faster gyro & PID loop times, and the BrainFPV re1 is locked in @ 3.2khz.

    As far as the tilt-rotors being directly connected to the elevator, the issue that I had run into at first was that I wanted the rotors to have an advance on their tilt, so that they would be at 45deg on their own before the rest of the craft had passed much more that 10-12 deg. The solution I found still directly correlates to the elevator, but on two channels now rather than one: primary channel is elevator retarded 50% and secondary channel is elevator advance to 125%.

    Best regards,
    JRogers

    PS: Still could use some suggestions for higher kv motors to try out on the Furious 320. The stock ones are just too slow for my taste, but I do enjoy that they're rather power efficient, compared to something like the T-Motor F60 PRO that is ;)
     
  8. J Rogers
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    J Rogers Member

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    Looking at the next and final upgrade... the motors! At this point I've replaced everything with the exception of the motors, the tilt servo and the camera. The tilt servo & camera are very basic items, such so that I deem the stock components sufficient, but I'd really appreciate some feedback in regards to my current choice of replacements...

    For the motors I'm looking at the T-Motor F80 Pro 2200kv which I'll be running with this 2200mah graphene lipo. With this combination I'll have to remove the battery bay cover, but I'll have a dramatic increase in thrust... I think... actually I have no idea of the specs of the stock Furious 320 motors, other than they are 1700kv, and the part number would suggest a stator size of 2815 and these 2200kv T-Motor F80 Pro's are a 2308 with a max thrust of 1866g, making 7464g a roundabout figure for maximum thrust(apx 6.67:1 thrust ratio).

    In regards to the ESC's, I currently have installed T-Motor 30A 3-4S running DShot 600 with zero issues; quiet happy. These T-Motor 30a 3-6S seem like they would be a safer bet given that they are actually rated to handle up to 6S batteries as apposed to the 4S ones that I currently have. I'm kinda considering pushing my luck and trying the 4S 30A ESC's with a 5S lipo given that in the past I had pushed some Afro 30A 4S ESC's to 6S for few weeks before realizing the potential issues and swapping out.

    I think that I'm going to start by ordering a couple of the batteries since they're on sale and I can always use them in another build. I'll test with the current setup, minus the battery bay cover, and see if the ESC's hold out. If they're good after a dozen flights or so, then I'll order up the set of T-Motor F80 Pro's!

    So far I've gotten her up to 95mph(153kph), and I want to see if I can't get at least another 25mph, with 120mph(193kph) being the goal of this project; 73kph beyond the original design specs ;) So... What am I forgetting/missing? Please, I'm all ears as I care not to be wasteful and I've already spent WAY TOO MUCH on this project... perhaps a drug addiction would be cheaper ;)
     
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  9. bjr981s
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    Very Very cool well done.
     
  10. J Rogers
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    ***Project Update***
    On the journey for break 100mph I've upgraded the battery from a 4S 2800mah lipo to a Graphine 5S 2200mah. Still with the stock motors... Still a no go :( To fit the 5S lipo it was necessary to remove the battery bay door, and it still weighed in at 1160g AUW, up 40g from 1120.

    I maxed out at 96mph @ 110amps while pervious attempts have been 96mph @ 75amps, so I think that I've pushed these motors as far as they'll go, but the 5S 2200mah had about the same flight time as the 4S 2800mah.

     

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